ame Informer Online Managing Editor Billy Berghammer caught up with Silicon Knights President Denis Dyack at the DICE Summit in Las Vegas, and got the skinny on Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes, future projects, the Nintendo DS, Kid Icarus, and Nintendo’s struggles.

Game Informer Online: Twin Snakes is obviously in the can and shipping to retailers. Why did you guys decide to re-make Metal Gear Solid?

Denis Dyack: The story behind it is I was in Japan with Mr. Miyamoto and Mr. Iwata after finishing Eternal Darkness and one time at lunch they both sat down with me and said out of the blue if I wanted to make a Metal Gear Solid game. I was somewhat shocked and surprised because I didn’t even think it was possible. One, it was a Konami game, two I just didn’t see how it could possibly be even made. But, Mr. Miyamoto told me that he had talked to Mr. Kojima and that he would be very interested in collaborating and doing something with Nintendo, but at that point it was impossible since they were working on MGS 3, and they didn’t have a team available. So Mr. Miyamoto said that he knew a team that was available and he regarded us very highly, which was a tremendous credit right there, and we really appreciated that. So he asked us if we would like to do it and we said sure. The next day Mr. Kojima came down to where we were staying in Tokyo and we talked, and all three companies (Nintendo, Konami, and Silicon Knights), and we agreed to move forward. The next week we flew to Japan with a team of about 10 and started talking and production began right away. So, that’s the story behind that. It’s kind of crazy. So basically within a week of not even thinking or knowing anything about the project, we moved very quickly.

GIO: So, this would have been about two years ago?

DD: Not quite that long ago, but approximately.

GIO: So what was it like working with Mr. Kojima?

DD: It was very cool. I think that he’s really a smart individual and he’s got some serious messages that he likes to tell, and has a lot of vision. And in many ways, I think that his group is very similar to our group in that they want to tell and provide the gamer with serious content. And, one thing that I think you could say about MGS, particularly the 1995 one, is that there some serious messages in there and that hadn’t been done up until that point. I think it was a landmark game and I think that his direction is very analogous and parallel to ours and where we want to take things. He’s a great guy and he’s one of the masters of the industry and it was a total pleasure.

GIO: Now in regards to this three way collaboration between Nintendo, Konami, and Silicon Knights, how much was Konami involved in the Twin Snakes in comparison to Silicon Knights. Was it 50-50?

DD: No, I would say that it was probably around 80-20. We collaborated on a lot of things. Konami generally worked on the cinematics; however we worked on them as well with effects and other things. Cinematography was generally done with Kojima and Kitamura-san, whose done movies like Vs, Alive, Sky High. and Azumi, some pretty cool movies actually. So he’s a Japanese movie film director and besides that we did all the rest. It was a big collaboration around the board, though, but it was mostly developed here. There was some development in Japan and we did collaborate across thousands of miles. The story has kept the spirit of the original and from that perspective that’s definitely on their end. Putting a percentage on it is very difficult but, so I just like to look at it as collaboration where we all worked well together. But it’s definitely a game developed at Silicon Knights.

GIO: Last year when you presented the game to the press, you, Mr. Kojima, and Mr. Miyamoto on stage. What was Mr. Miyamoto’s involvement in Twin Snakes?

DD: Mr. Miyamoto is generally involved in every project with Nintendo and I would say that his level of involvement was consistent with that. And, he had input and we had various conference calls and him and Mr. Kojima talked about everything and how the game was going and without Mr. Miyamoto the game would have never happened because it required tremendous support from Nintendo as well. So, from that standpoint, I’d say that it’s consistent with other games.  It’s really a hard question to answer from a perspective of that he had a lot to do with it.

GIO: At the end of the development cycle of Eternal Darkness you said that you guys worked really closely with EAD to polish, tweak and make certain additions to the game. Was EAD involved with the production of Twin Snakes?

DD: Yes they were. And we had various representatives from EAD working with us on the project as well.

GIO: So, what was it like, since Canada isn’t that close to Japan, splitting up the development up between the two countries and what challenges did that pose to the project?

DD: It was landmark in that regard - I don’t think anyone’s done that before.  We actually had the code changing 24 hours a day because Konami would update some stuff. Don’t forget that we’re like 13 or 14 hours apart (time change wise) so a lot of our guys worked very late hours. But at the end of the day things were constantly changing around the clock so we had a secure network that we collaborated across thousands of miles, updating the code constantly and cinematics in the game. We had four to five video conference calls per week with Konami, and we had several conference calls a week with Nintendo. We had people from Nintendo and Konami visit us regularly and we visited Japan regularly. Also, on top of all that, we had people from Konami stay here quite a long time, with one person actually staying for a full year. I’ve never heard of a project being done like that. From that perspective, I think these kinds of collaborations will be step forward for the industry and I think that from our perspective it was a great learning experience. Sort of seeing how Mr. Kojima’s group works and it was really rewarding.

GIO: How much exactly was used from the original game?

DD: The original game? Almost nothing, besides the story.

GIO: So, the game engine was created from the ground up?

DD: Well, there were certain elements from MGS2 that we certainly worked with, and that made sense. But generally it was a lot from scratch.

GIO: Was there anything from the original game that for some reason you couldn’t bring over to this version?

DD: Actually, a lot of things. Some of the design mechanics from MGS2 didn’t really work with MGS1 so we had to come up with alternatives and different ways of doing things and make sure that it worked right. And, it had to be done in a seamless way so I’m not sure if people are really going to notice because if they stand out you’ve really done it wrong.  But we really had to take significant steps to ensure that the game played seamlessly and fit within the gameplay mechanic and at the same time keep the spirit of the original game. One of the things, as an example of one of the enhancements we did, was have the guards clear outside. It’s not really that clear, I think some people will notice, but some others may not. And all they’ll know and think is that the AI is tougher and those are some of the enhancements and changes that we made to the game.

GIO: Obviously the Metal Gear Solid crowd, the hardcore fans out there, are very hardcore and very hypercritical of anybody touching this franchise. Was it tough to appease that sort of hardcore crowd?

DD: Well, I would say that the pressure on making this quality of game was very, very high. From the perspective that you have the hardcore MGS fans who really expect a lot from a Metal Gear game and Mr. Kojima’s group. And then you’ve got Nintendo fans, who generally, are just as hardcore and they expect tremendous levels of quality. So when you combine Mr. Kojima’s name with Mr. Miyamoto’s name and throw us in the middle there’s a lot of pressure to perform. But overall, I think we’ve met the watermark and I think gamers are going to be happy and looking at the responses so far, since it’s only been out a day, we think people are fairly pleased. Hopefully that will continue.  I think that so far, so good.

GIO: So why should someone who played through the original and paid 50 bucks back in the day go back and do it all over again?

DD: In our opinion, it’s a totally different experience. The gameplay has been so dramatically changed and you can do so many new things that you couldn’t do in the original – from that perspective it’s a real new adventure. All the art and technology has been completely redone and enhanced. The music has all been redone and the only part that’s really been kept is the story. Besides that it’s entirely new, especially the cinematics. When you see them it puts a really different slant and perspective on the story itself and I think that Mr. Kojima and Mr. Kitamura really want to bring that to the forefront. From what you’ve so far, what do you think?

GIO: I’ve seen a lot of cinematics before, but friends of mine who have seen the new movies have been blown away.

DD: That’s great. I hope the word of mouth really carries the game because I think that a person who has played the original is going to have such a new experience that he’s going to find it rewarding, yet still remember the spirit of the original. When someone who’s never played the game before is exposed to one of the best landmark games in the industry for a long time, and I think it’s a game worth playing.

GIO: In regards to the fact that MGS2 was on the PS2 and this is on the GameCube, were there any hardware issues you or Konami faced when trying to bring a game like this on the GameCube?

DD: Well, certainly it’s a different system. But in general we thought we could push it further, and felt as comfortable that we did with the Cube, and enhancing it beyond the abilities of the PS2. So, not really I guess. But, we moved forward and tackled it and are pretty happy with how it turned out.

GIO: This is the third GameCube game that I’ve played that have had a certain problem, and Eternal Darkness was the first one that this issue happened with, where I had some video and audio mis-syncings.

DD: What?! Really? I’ve never heard of any problems with MGS having that problem. So you’re saying that the cinematics are skipping?

GIO: One part did, at least the only part that I saw. I did try the game on my Panasonic Q and another system…

DD: You modded your system didn’t you?

GIO: Yes.

DD: Well, you’re asking for trouble, you’re playing with the synchronization of the laser. If you played it on a regular Cube was it OK?

GIO: Yeah.

DD: Well, there you go. I cannot be responsible for you modifying your GameCube under the hood Mr. Billy. (laughs)

GIO: I just had to ask about that.  (laughs)

DD: Honest to God, I couldn’t believe that. I’ve never heard of that in any of the testing and it’s never come up as an issue ever.

GIO: Well, with ED it was huge, and I was wondering if it was just because the systems were modded or...

DD: It was generally because the system was modded, yes.

GIO: Okay, getting back to Twin Snakes, you obviously re-did all the visuals and everything, what’s your favorite new cutscene that you guys did?

DD: My favorite overall is the cinematic near the end with the cyber-ninja, I thought that was really, really good. I do enjoy the one that you just saw as well. But, there are many, many goods ones.

GIO: Like the one with Revolver Ocelot?

DD: Yeah, I love that one. I like the beginning one with him, too, when he’s spinning the gun. But at the end of the day, I think they’re all really cool and I think there’s just some fun stuff in there and you can really see some obvious humor in there and it’s well balanced and really brings the spirit of the game to the forefront.

GIO: Now, which is your favorite boss battle?

DD: I would probably say Vulcan Raven is my favorite, the second one. But I we did some fun stuff in that one. I also think that Psycho Mantis is really cool and I think you’ll appreciate the fun stuff we did in that one.

GIO: What was the thought process in bringing the first person element into the game?

DD: I just think that, in general, was a progression that the Metal Gear games have gone through. And I think that it’s an enhancement that players will make them explore the game more. So, it was a pretty straight forward decision to include that in the game. It really changes the game, we understand that, but I think it’s for the better.

GIO: Was that your call or Konami’s call?

DD: A joint call.

GIO: Do you think that that element makes the game easier?

DD: Some would say yes, some would say no. Reading the boards lately, some people are saying that this game is harder, which is surprising. Certainly on the Extreme modes it’s very hard, but on the Easy modes it’s pretty easy. So, I don’t know. Some things are easier, some things are harder. I think that maybe the AI, since it’s enhanced, make it more difficult and shooting in first person mode is more comfortable for some people. I just think that it makes it different, but not necessarily easier or harder.

GIO: Do you guys foresee doing another collaboration between Silicon Knights and Konami?

DD: Absolutely. We’ve talked about this and we’re just ready for the right timing at this point. We’ve pretty much agreed at this point that it’s going to be an original title, and I look forward to working with Mr. Kojima and his group in the future and I think that they’re a great bunch of guys and very talented and some of the best developers in the industry and think another collaboration would be a very good thing.

GIO: Metal Gear aside, at last year’s DICE Summit, you basically came out and said indirectly that you were doing a MGS title without anyone really realizing it.

DD: Someone asked what our next game would be like and I said a lot like MGS. That was kind of my inside joke.

GIO: Yes.  You’ve been making some references lately, in certain places in the press, that if you could redo a game it would be Kid Icarus. Are you teasing us and just kidding or is this going to happen?

DD: I’m never kidding; I’m always very straight forward. I’ll say this: all the readers out there are very, very clever people. And, at the end of the day if I’m ever going to drop another hint like that again, and I may have already, it’s never going to be in the same vein since people would pick it up too fast. Answering if we would like to do something like Kid Icarus, we absolutely would because I think it would be a great fit for us. I think that we really understand mythologies here and we really like that kind of content. There have also been rumors about Zelda. We’d really love to make a hardcore dark Zelda, but at the end of the day, that’s something that needs to be discussed with Mr. Miyamoto and his group and that’s his baby. Certainly collaborations like that are possible but at this point, that’s just me answering a question. People ask me what I would like to do and I say ‘these,’ but that doesn’t mean that it’s going to happen. In Metal Gear I was being very clever and sometimes being clever doesn’t work for you that well as we all know from the Fight Club but I could have been caught with my pants down and I’m glad that no one caught on. I know that some of the reps that were with me when I did that interview looked at me.

GIO: Hypothetically, if you envisioned a Kid Icarus on modern hardware today, what kind of game would it be?

DD: If it came from us? I think it would be mature, dark, and thoughtful. I think you can pretty much say that about most of our games. I think that’s our trademark. We want serious content, we want people to think, and we want to make something people will want to play and those are things that I’m interested in and those are the kinds of things people here are interested in and we’d take it in a direction that we would want to play ourselves. I know that’s something everyone in our industry says, but at the end of the day, you really have to create something that you not only think will be successful, but something that you also love. As Mr. Miyamoto says, creating games is like making music and you have to really feel a passion for it and it has to be buried deep within your heart.

GIO: So is it safe to assume that there will be at least one more Silicon Knights title for the GameCube?

DD: I can’t talk about any future titles, sorry. Any illumination to that would not be the right thing to do at this time.

GIO: I think it would be the perfect time! (laughs)

DD: You think it would be perfect? To illuminate or to have a game on the Cube?

GIO: Both! Can you say how many projects you guys have in the pipe right now?

DD: No. I can’t, sorry.

GIO: Are you working on anything for the next Nintendo home console?

DD: Next gen? I think it’s pretty hard not to be working on or thinking about next gen at this point. I’m not going to say officially either way, but next gen is coming up right around the corner soon and most developers have their eyes in that direction.

GIO: When do you think the next consoles will be released?

DD: I think everyone’s announced 2006, haven’t they?

GIO: Not officially.

DD: Oh, I thought they had. If I had to unofficially guess, I would say 2006, third or fourth quarter. But I don’t know for sure - it’s just my personal opinion on it. In my eyes, I think everyone is going to release around the same time. It’s gong to be an exciting time for hardware launch and I’m looking forward to it.

GIO: Speaking of new hardware, what do you think of the Nintendo DS?

DD: I think it’s pretty cool and has potential.

GIO: Have you seen it?

DD: I can’t comment on that.

GIO: Do you think there’s room in the market for a “third pillar” when it comes to Nintendo?

DD: That’s a tough call, I think we’re about to find out. I certainly thing there’s possibilities there, but time will tell. Answering that question is like saying who’s going to win the next console wars. No one really knows the answer to that. I certainly hope so and I really hope that the DS is a huge success. Beyond that, it’s just pure speculation.

GIO: You’re obviously a Nintendo second party, but you’ve worked very closely with the company for many years now. Nintendo is kind of in a rough spot right now. You’ve seen the successes of the GameCube and some of the failures. What do you think can change that, what could be done to “save the Cube?”

DD: I don’t think that the Cube needs to be saved; I think that what needs to be saved about the Cube is everyone’s perception of it. The GameCube has done fairly well, profitably wise. But, at the end of the day, the perception of it is pretty low and creating games like Twin Snakes and others that are coming down the pipe like Resident Evil 4, which I can’t wait for, I think games like that will really turn it around for the Cube and make people think that the system is really cool and something that they have to have and play. So at this point, I think that’s what needs to be changed. Is it possible that Nintendo will overtake Sony and the PS2? It’s possible, but unlikely. But, at the end of the day I really think that that’s what we really need to work on and what everyone is working on. I think that the Cube has had some great games and even more are coming down the pipe and hopefully Twin Snakes is a good step in that direction.

GIO: So, do you think Too Human would be a nice “next” GameCube launch title?

DD: I think it would be a pretty cool title in general (laughs). You dirty dog! I have to say that I haven’t had an interview in three years where someone hasn’t asked a question about TH.

GIO: Well, Space World 2000 was a long time ago.

DD: It was.

GIO: You did collaboration and got off easy on one game (laughs), so at least that one was cake. You have a pretty big staff.

DD: When the time’s right, we’ll start talking about it.

GIO: Will you be showing any of your games at E3 this year?

DD: I can’t talk about E3 yet, it’s too soon, sorry. I know that’s an excellent answer.

GIO: Well, I could ask about Eternal Darkness 2 and the whole prequel or sequel issue but I don’t think I would get much of an answer out of you.

DD: Well, it depends on what you ask.

GIO: What would you like to see the next Eternal Darkness title to be, a prequel or a sequel?

DD: The next Eternal Darkness will expand upon the universe and tell stories that need to be told and have not been told and explain a few things that haven’t been explained yet.

GIO: So, there will be another Eternal Darkness game someday?

DD: Some day, we certainly hope so.